Doth mine eyes betray me? Behold, yet another chapter unfoldeth! Hard on the heels of one that didst taste as sweet as nectar, I fear thou aim'st to slay me with a surfeit of sweetness. Though 'sour' the title claims, I dread still the demise by sugary chains.
I have thoughts on the ketamine topic. I don't expect you to know everything, I just have some personal experience I'd like to share. I've undergone treatment (always and only legally) a few times: two rounds of multi-day infusions for a painful nerve condition and at-home troches (lozenges) for depression (more or less once a week). It _may_ have helped with the pain, it didn't do anything for the depression. I've never done illicit drugs, so it was quite an experience. Made me super sick but the experience is otherwise beautiful. Moynihan is right that it seems to mostly have some potential with the severely suicidal. Scott Alexander wrote a lot about it and he says it _does_ alter your brain in a more long-term fashion, but my experience is more that it's just a wild ride that can interrupt whatever is going on in your head.
One area where I have strong feelings is with the nasal spray: Esketamine. It's horrible. Horrible in the sense that it's actually LESS effective than standard ketamine. But with our messed up system companies couldn't make money on that because it's a generic now and so they invented a worse drug to sell for more money.
I think some of the more recent studies are showing the early hype was overblown though. There are some showing limited positive results and maybe even (if I recall) no benefit after a short time. The results last for a few days to a week.
In the end the troches made me so sick that I had to stop. Plus, they weren't helping much, if at all.
I too have used legal ketamine for depression. I have what's today called Persistent Depressive Disorder, the fancy term for a chronic depression that isn't usually horrible, but enough to ruin your life. Had it since my teens and it doesn't respond to meds or most therapies.
I do IV infusions. About a year ago I had my initial series of six and then I get two every two months. The most dramatic change was I have always had a severe suicidal ideation, just not the will to act on it. After ketamine those thoughts literally just went away. Otherwise a mixed bag. I am interested in psychedelics as an avenue to mental change, but no real access to them other than ketamine(anyone have Nick Gillespie's number?) and I was hoping to get that with ketamine, but only had partial response.
I have heard Spravato, the nasal spray, can really underperform, often delivering only 20 percent of the necessary dose. I have never tried troches, but I am debating trying them. The problem Ketamine is experiencing is it is almost becoming a spa type drug. Clinics are popping up everywhere with little regulation and there is a big debate over who is best to prescribe ketamine anesthesiologists or psychiatrists.
I don't mean to side with the scolds, but the main reason I love it now is it is just a wonderful experience. I too have no experience with drugs, and ketamine really allows you to escape the BS of the world and just be in your own head space. When you are easily subject to overwhelm just knowing you can go to your "safe space" even for a short bit is such a joy.
That just sucks. I hate depression. - and what a stuuuupid name for living death. I pretty much missed out on all of my 30s bcs of that beast. What a horror. Sorry you have to live with it. I just hate it.
I too have zero experience with drugs and wonder where all these people get them! I've never even seen pot much less coke or heroin. Rob Long (aka Martini Shot pod) has me convinced about micro doses of LSD. But where in the heck does one get LSD?? I could *really* use a little vacation from my brain.
Also a sufferer of depression — like all the smartest, coolest people. I think of it as a wave: Some times I’m riding it, some times I’m under it. But I hate taking drugs, even if they help. (I don’t drink, either.) So, I just let the wave engulf me. It’s fine. I’m fine. (glub glub)
Your approach sounds amazingly healthy and much more peaceful than my rage :) Back when it was treacherously bad, I had online friends recommend to me Tolle/Hahn books. They advised sitting with the dark instead of struggling against it - it’s not as if struggling helped. I read, a tried to sit and accept (more like relent) but then I started having tsunami recurring dreams. I don’t think I’m brave enough to let the wave engulf me. Glub indeed.
Oh, no, it’s terrible. It’s not bravery, it’s resignation. But there’s no one around to throw me a life preserver, so it only affects me.
The last time I went for a physical, to a new doctor whose bedside manner left much to be desired — my doctor of many years, a great physician and guy, moved far away — he conducted no examination but asked me a long series of questions. Frustrating. When depression came up and he asked if I’d had thoughts of suicide, I replied, “Not until now.”
Anyway, he suggested Lexapro, which I’ve taken in the past, but I don’t like the side effects.
"But there’s no one around to throw me a life preserver, so it only affects me." I don't know what you mean by this, but from now on *I* am around. I'll send you my email/number. If only I had a life preserver, if only... but I will tell you all the things we need to be reminded of while in the abyss.
Ya the meds suck. I was on cymbalta for a year and it was all side effects, no improvement. I'm going to have to borrow your "not until now" line. :)
I hear you, I have the same experience with depression. Multiple medications failed, although duloxetine worked really well until it stopped after a few years. The latest thing is TMS, it's worked wonders. Oddly enough though, not until the end of the 30 days of treatment.
I was lucky enough to have a psychiatrist willing to prescribe the troches and a compounding pharmacy to make them.
I agree the experience is amazing. I felt like I was near a breakthrough many times but it never came. The catatonic infusions were other worldly though. Time and space and identity totally dissolved and reality was turned on its head.
But all forms make me so sick. I often throw up. It's just so unpleasant at that point.
Did they give you Zofran or something similar before the treatment for the nausea? Before my infusion they inject Zofran in the tube and I haven't had any nausea issues.
I had TMS before the ketamine. That definitely did not work for me! I had the infamous "TMS dip" twice and it was bad. Hadn't felt depressed like that seen my teen years.
I can relate to your experiences. During one of last treatments it felt so easy and straightforward. It was smooth sailing and I had figured out everything to existence. That started to wear off right around the same time that the ketamine was wearing off. But it was amazing while it lasted.
Oh yeah. I got Zofran. When that didn't work enough they gave me Phenergan. That seemed to help, but destroyed my veins. But I don't really have access to that with the at-home troches and it's the bitter, disgusting taste that just makes my stomach spasm and makes me throw up.
Dang, I'm sorry the TMS didn't help. It's been one of the few things that have helped me but it's so weird that it doesn't help until the VERY end (this last time it didn't help until after the treatments were over).
Yeah, the experience DURING the ketamine is amazing. I know some people for whom it is persistent. I'm just not really one of them.
Best of luck to you though going forward! Feel free to commiserate anytime.
I started esketamine (Spravato) treatment almost two years ago, and it’s been life-changing. No exaggeration. I wasn’t suicidal, but I was pretty zombie-like, and after a couple visits I realized I was capable of actually doing something with my life other than passively suffering through it. I’ve been gradually spacing out treatments, and am getting it every five weeks now, so it definitely lasts longer than a week in my case.
I've prayed everyone here can find some peace and stability. I've had some seasons of mild anxiety and depression myself, but I've also been a first-hand witness to much worse.
Speaking of racist foods., there is a packaged oreo-like cookie sold in Turkey called Negro, and negro is not the word for the color black in Turkish. But, they've got a lot of weird food names over there - Lady's Thigh Balls, Your Aunt, and Noah's Ark. All delicious.
What? Already??? The new shoes are giving you super powers Matt!
I’m demanding a mea culpa from you guys for releasing more content than I have time for at the moment. The world is watching.
#FloodTFC
#FreePodcast
#FromPalomaToOurEars
#ByAnyMemesNecessary
I just finished lunch and will go on a hunger strike between now and dinner time to demonstrate how serious this issue is.
🫡 Bravest hunger-striker in America right now! Don't forget to make an allowance for light snacking, because self-care is a revolutionary act!
Somebody bring this man a sandwich STAT
Doth mine eyes betray me? Behold, yet another chapter unfoldeth! Hard on the heels of one that didst taste as sweet as nectar, I fear thou aim'st to slay me with a surfeit of sweetness. Though 'sour' the title claims, I dread still the demise by sugary chains.
I was going to write the same thing.
Appreciate the sobriety and good sense on all things Trump. And sorry for praising your sobriety.
Amplifying Don Lemon and Candace Owen's smh.
This is the real super Tuesday!!!
I’ve listened to two episodes in one day and I’m giddy 💃🏻💃🏻💃🏻
Hmmm, Megyn Kelly? Sounds like a bloodbath coming out of her eyes, coming out of her...whatever...
I propose the term “heterodoxual.”
I have thoughts on the ketamine topic. I don't expect you to know everything, I just have some personal experience I'd like to share. I've undergone treatment (always and only legally) a few times: two rounds of multi-day infusions for a painful nerve condition and at-home troches (lozenges) for depression (more or less once a week). It _may_ have helped with the pain, it didn't do anything for the depression. I've never done illicit drugs, so it was quite an experience. Made me super sick but the experience is otherwise beautiful. Moynihan is right that it seems to mostly have some potential with the severely suicidal. Scott Alexander wrote a lot about it and he says it _does_ alter your brain in a more long-term fashion, but my experience is more that it's just a wild ride that can interrupt whatever is going on in your head.
One area where I have strong feelings is with the nasal spray: Esketamine. It's horrible. Horrible in the sense that it's actually LESS effective than standard ketamine. But with our messed up system companies couldn't make money on that because it's a generic now and so they invented a worse drug to sell for more money.
I think some of the more recent studies are showing the early hype was overblown though. There are some showing limited positive results and maybe even (if I recall) no benefit after a short time. The results last for a few days to a week.
In the end the troches made me so sick that I had to stop. Plus, they weren't helping much, if at all.
I too have used legal ketamine for depression. I have what's today called Persistent Depressive Disorder, the fancy term for a chronic depression that isn't usually horrible, but enough to ruin your life. Had it since my teens and it doesn't respond to meds or most therapies.
I do IV infusions. About a year ago I had my initial series of six and then I get two every two months. The most dramatic change was I have always had a severe suicidal ideation, just not the will to act on it. After ketamine those thoughts literally just went away. Otherwise a mixed bag. I am interested in psychedelics as an avenue to mental change, but no real access to them other than ketamine(anyone have Nick Gillespie's number?) and I was hoping to get that with ketamine, but only had partial response.
I have heard Spravato, the nasal spray, can really underperform, often delivering only 20 percent of the necessary dose. I have never tried troches, but I am debating trying them. The problem Ketamine is experiencing is it is almost becoming a spa type drug. Clinics are popping up everywhere with little regulation and there is a big debate over who is best to prescribe ketamine anesthesiologists or psychiatrists.
I don't mean to side with the scolds, but the main reason I love it now is it is just a wonderful experience. I too have no experience with drugs, and ketamine really allows you to escape the BS of the world and just be in your own head space. When you are easily subject to overwhelm just knowing you can go to your "safe space" even for a short bit is such a joy.
That just sucks. I hate depression. - and what a stuuuupid name for living death. I pretty much missed out on all of my 30s bcs of that beast. What a horror. Sorry you have to live with it. I just hate it.
I too have zero experience with drugs and wonder where all these people get them! I've never even seen pot much less coke or heroin. Rob Long (aka Martini Shot pod) has me convinced about micro doses of LSD. But where in the heck does one get LSD?? I could *really* use a little vacation from my brain.
Also a sufferer of depression — like all the smartest, coolest people. I think of it as a wave: Some times I’m riding it, some times I’m under it. But I hate taking drugs, even if they help. (I don’t drink, either.) So, I just let the wave engulf me. It’s fine. I’m fine. (glub glub)
Your approach sounds amazingly healthy and much more peaceful than my rage :) Back when it was treacherously bad, I had online friends recommend to me Tolle/Hahn books. They advised sitting with the dark instead of struggling against it - it’s not as if struggling helped. I read, a tried to sit and accept (more like relent) but then I started having tsunami recurring dreams. I don’t think I’m brave enough to let the wave engulf me. Glub indeed.
Oh, no, it’s terrible. It’s not bravery, it’s resignation. But there’s no one around to throw me a life preserver, so it only affects me.
The last time I went for a physical, to a new doctor whose bedside manner left much to be desired — my doctor of many years, a great physician and guy, moved far away — he conducted no examination but asked me a long series of questions. Frustrating. When depression came up and he asked if I’d had thoughts of suicide, I replied, “Not until now.”
Anyway, he suggested Lexapro, which I’ve taken in the past, but I don’t like the side effects.
"But there’s no one around to throw me a life preserver, so it only affects me." I don't know what you mean by this, but from now on *I* am around. I'll send you my email/number. If only I had a life preserver, if only... but I will tell you all the things we need to be reminded of while in the abyss.
Ya the meds suck. I was on cymbalta for a year and it was all side effects, no improvement. I'm going to have to borrow your "not until now" line. :)
I hear you, I have the same experience with depression. Multiple medications failed, although duloxetine worked really well until it stopped after a few years. The latest thing is TMS, it's worked wonders. Oddly enough though, not until the end of the 30 days of treatment.
I was lucky enough to have a psychiatrist willing to prescribe the troches and a compounding pharmacy to make them.
I agree the experience is amazing. I felt like I was near a breakthrough many times but it never came. The catatonic infusions were other worldly though. Time and space and identity totally dissolved and reality was turned on its head.
But all forms make me so sick. I often throw up. It's just so unpleasant at that point.
Did they give you Zofran or something similar before the treatment for the nausea? Before my infusion they inject Zofran in the tube and I haven't had any nausea issues.
I had TMS before the ketamine. That definitely did not work for me! I had the infamous "TMS dip" twice and it was bad. Hadn't felt depressed like that seen my teen years.
I can relate to your experiences. During one of last treatments it felt so easy and straightforward. It was smooth sailing and I had figured out everything to existence. That started to wear off right around the same time that the ketamine was wearing off. But it was amazing while it lasted.
Oh yeah. I got Zofran. When that didn't work enough they gave me Phenergan. That seemed to help, but destroyed my veins. But I don't really have access to that with the at-home troches and it's the bitter, disgusting taste that just makes my stomach spasm and makes me throw up.
Dang, I'm sorry the TMS didn't help. It's been one of the few things that have helped me but it's so weird that it doesn't help until the VERY end (this last time it didn't help until after the treatments were over).
Yeah, the experience DURING the ketamine is amazing. I know some people for whom it is persistent. I'm just not really one of them.
Best of luck to you though going forward! Feel free to commiserate anytime.
I started esketamine (Spravato) treatment almost two years ago, and it’s been life-changing. No exaggeration. I wasn’t suicidal, but I was pretty zombie-like, and after a couple visits I realized I was capable of actually doing something with my life other than passively suffering through it. I’ve been gradually spacing out treatments, and am getting it every five weeks now, so it definitely lasts longer than a week in my case.
I've prayed everyone here can find some peace and stability. I've had some seasons of mild anxiety and depression myself, but I've also been a first-hand witness to much worse.
I wouldn't wish it on anybody.
I'm so glad it's working for you!
Matt’s Nelba Blanton/Nellie Bowles joke deserves a shout out.
Speaking of racist foods., there is a packaged oreo-like cookie sold in Turkey called Negro, and negro is not the word for the color black in Turkish. But, they've got a lot of weird food names over there - Lady's Thigh Balls, Your Aunt, and Noah's Ark. All delicious.
I'm begging you to stop mispronouncing Nevada that way
You _really_ don't want to hear how my 8YO says it. It's not "Neh VAH duh" or "Nev æ duh," but "Neh veh duh."
I still haven't recovered from yesterday!
The end of the podcast reminded me of the time I was driving through NE Arkansas and came across the poorly thought out daycare name "Hugs and Tugs."
Kmele's hot spicy and juicy beef Jamaican patties. We once had "Hot Pockets" and now ... Kmele's "Patty Boyz"?