Now I’m asking myself why aren’t I in the book club. I can read. Most things. Someone send me the link to the WhatsApp. I need to start mouthing words again.
As the internet goes, it was a pretty mild rebuke or calling out or whatever. And very much in line with the tone of this podcast which I enjoy and subscribe to. And he didn’t resort to name calling. At least in spirit, applaud and celebrate the observations you don’t necessarily like, unless they’re vile or defamatory. And unless, of course, the poster is a non-subscriber.
Generally, shit talking is best among friends and when it's funny. Also, your confidence in how Cormac would respond to a genuine admirer of his is misplaced.
I’m only 10 minutes into the episode and it’s already exceeding my expectations for being off the rails. I saw the comments and wow, it’s much worse (and I mean better) than I could have hoped for.
I like to think all my fav podcast folks live in the same building and make the bulk of their income from having each other as guests. I would like to see the following:
Matt on Feminine Chaos, Moyn on Bridget Phetasy, and Kmele gets to take his dulcimer tones over to Smoke'em cause those gals deserve a breather from all the doom.
Well since Meghan has actually been on Nancy and Sarah's she's incestuously adjacent whether she likes it or not and we'll be going down with the rest of us.
I actually meant Meghan Murphy(The Same Drugs). Yes, she's probably in her own zone with a lot of her own issues, but she's becoming sort of the Blocked and Reported of Canada with her free speech commentary. Also the boys need to get her on just because a drunk Michael would SOOOOOOOOO hit on her.
Note: I initially included Anna & Dasha of Red Scare, another of my favorites, but those ladies are doing their own thing. Popular recurring characters.
I imagine Noam, Glenn & John would fill the wise neighbor roles.
Nice! Imma check that. Yeah what is WITH the Red Scare ladies? It seems like no one really acknowledges they exist, or they act like no one else does. It is such an outlier to me, Anna is one of the funniest and smartest talking heads I have come across in years. Maybe its because they are always floating around topics and people that are... complicated? But I see Red Scare and Feminine Chaos as like two sides of a coin. The salt in the sweet or whatever.
The ladies don’t take the pod, or themselves, too seriously, which is part of their appeal. They’ve joked about the loose format, and both have other successful careers — in fields where one would think their “heterodox” views would hold them back. Their flat affect and seeming detachment belies their wit and intelligence. They are both very smart, very cool. I’d love to hang out with them (although I detest cigarette smoke).
100% agree. That is what got me hooked. The first time I heard them with all that vocal fry and "like" or "whatevers" my brain kinda stopped processing, but as I listened I was like "Holy hell! these are wolves in sheep's clothing". You know, it occurs to me they might be too "cool kids" "dimesquare" for most. Even though they would say they are too uncool for that very crowd. I love me some lists of videos, have prolly seen a couple of them, but will be chasing that stuff this weekend for sure, so thanks for that! I am consistently making playlists for myself just due to my hoarding nature. :D Also signed up for askajew. I have a few jews I rely on for my questions, but can always use more. :D
I do think there is kind of a synergy forming with libertarians and the anti-woke left. It's like a new version of the IDW. It would be interesting to make one of those networking charts they tried to tar Joe Rogan with, but as a map of who is palling around with whom.
Yes! Kmele on Phetasy could get just uncomfortable enough to be really funny if she goes full Phetasy. Though I hear she's married w/ a kid now, so probably not.
Man, you’re gonna make me do math? 😆 It was published in 2021, so I think it was pre-kid* but not pre-marriage.
*I think she has said her baby is 2 now? It’s been a while since I listened to the episode, so I can’t remember what they talked about. (Maybe she mentioned marriage/pregnancy, I’m not sure.)
If you haven’t listened to her on the recent “Ask a Jew” podcast, she talked about working at Playboy and other stuff that seems pretty “Classic Bridget” to me.
I'm working late tonight, listened to this hilarious episode - ending with how Moynihan would never watch the film version of London Fields.
Laughing my face off, so I scroll to some old episodes to keep it going, happened upon #357 with Lara Bazelon, and lost it, when 5 minutes in Moynihan admits to watching London Fields and how bad it was, weird timing, because I definitely wasn't looking to bust him out, but thought it was so funny that was what came up right away
My crush on him still stands, he makes me laugh til I cry, especially when he's showing off for Megan
Kat "Rosenfeld" was amazing. Loved it. I also absolutely relate personally to her story on many levels. I haven't made it to her level of success, and I'm not a journalist, but I am a YA novelist and I had many experiences with rejection based on being a WSM (White Straight Male). I started writing my novel in 2008 but it wasn't until hiring a former Random House editor that I began getting literary agents interested in reading the full book. One read it three times and wrote me glowing emails...yet disappeared. This was in 2016, just at the moment Kat refers to. One agent basically said, You know, we've had enough white male coming-of-age stories; it's time for something else. (As if each white male writer is the same and doesn't bring new style, vitality and expression to each original, fresh book.) It seemed like the beginning of The Death of Art. It's true: YA was Ground Zero for fringe Left Woke ID politics; it became less a literary genre than a tired cliche of progressive politics. That's why I finally said Screw The Gatekeepers and published the book myself. And it's doing quite well.
Okay, 17 minutes in and completely bonkers. I’m shocked that this is free and not paywalled for their own good. I did listen to Kat’s episode on the Live from the Cellar, and can only assume they guys share the sentiment that cancelation is over? Or was that only about the Metoo movement being over? Either way I’m loving the unhinged episode
Noam is too optimistic about it being over. The unhinged far left isn’t going anywhere. It’s like wack a mole, we may win this round where people stop listening to them, but they’ll just come up somewhere else and make themselves relevant again
Candace Owens backstory - she didn't come out of nowhere, she came out of Gamergate, and if you want the backstory of that early culture war blowup, listen to the latest episode of Blocked & Reported. Interestingly, she started out on the social-justicey anti-Gamergate side, building a database of pro-Gamergate "harassers". This was seen as a grift by the folks she was supposed to be allied with, and long story short, she ended up flipping sides and took a rapid trajectory toward far-right politics. Ian Miles Cheong was another figure that stared out as an obscure anti-GGer, and underwent a similar trajectory to Candace Owens. Milo Yiannopulos was yet another right-wing culture warrior who gained greater notoriety on the coattails of support for Gamergate. On the other side, anti-Gamergate launched the careers of several ultra-progressives, notably Arthur Chu, Brianna Wu, and Zoe Quinn, and also raised the profile of feminist video game critic Anita Sarkeesian. However, the latter bunch all seem to have a much lower profile these days - basically, their high-profile opposition to Gamergate gave them a proverbial 15 minutes of fame that they couldn't sustain once that cultural moment had passed.
Kat Rosenfield is always worth waiting for. Once FC and Sophia left Meaningoflifetv it was the death knell for MOLTV. Still follow her and Phoebe and glad they kept their podcast going.
P.S. Honestly? I thought it was -Feld too. The Mandela effect?
I did as well and it made me realize I need an eye exam because I literally didn’t see the “I” on her Twitter handle in all the years I’ve been following her.
2) I believe this was meaningoflifetv’s philosophy-centric programming
3) Along with Bloggingheads, Robert Wright’s YouTube podcasting network (originally hosted elsewhere, I believe). The Glenn Show got its start at BH as well as Feminine Chaos, Wright’s pod with Mickey Kaus, DMZ with Matt Lewis and Bill Scher, and many others. BH tended towards current events, politics, and cultural criticism, while Meaning of Life was philosophy/spirituality-oriented. Wright folded BH a couple years ago (most of the pods had gone independent by then) but he might be continuing some of philosophy programming under his Non-Zero channel.
Thanks. Feminine Chaos is one of my favorite podcasts. “Sophia” confused me, and I’d never heard of MOLTV. I first started watching The Glenn Show, another favorite, on BH, which is where I discovered Kat and Phoebe. I used to watch Wright and Kaus too, but I drifted away from the channel after TGS and FC moved to Substack.
Thank you for doing my heavy lifting for me Kathleen.
The only thing I would expand on is yes Sophia was a philosophy oriented podcast under Wright's banner. While often technically philosophical, especially in the old days, I think people here would like the host Daniel Kaufman. He taught philosophy at Missouri State. He didn't countenance the far left or far right much and criticized a lot of modern philosophy for falling prey to the publish or perish syndrome and consequently felt that a lot of what was being published in philosophy was irrelevant. He turned to
more cultural and personal topics in the style of Montaigne.
He too left Wright's channel and started two subsequent channels, first the Electric Agora, and now Cathode Ray Zone. You can find both his Wright and post-Wright podcasts called Sophia on Spotify.
I’VE BEEN WAITING FOR THIS FOR SO LONG!!!! ❤️❤️❤️❤️
This is even better for them all being in studio.
Same. And it is going exactly how I expected :D
So true 💀
I kinda picture Kat stiff arming Moyn's rhetorical gymnastics like the Heisman Trophy, with a slice of pizza in her hand instead of a football. :D
Let the girl eat her pizza!!!
IKR! I wonder if its cold pizza. Cause that would fit the fif vibe.
WRONG! Straight from Door Dash or whatnot.
Fun facts:
Kat was on the Fifth Column Bookclub podcast* before the Fifth Column.
The Fifth Column Bookclub is currently reading Blood Meridian.
* It's not really a podcast, just a series of ephemeral Zoom calls.
Now I’m asking myself why aren’t I in the book club. I can read. Most things. Someone send me the link to the WhatsApp. I need to start mouthing words again.
Ya bitch you should definitely be in bookclub https://chat.whatsapp.com/C7EL63VG9Vo5uw4YCPRFqD
Anyone know how to get WhatsApp on an iPad? There are several different options in the App store
Yes! I want to be in the book club! All my books are from references on TFC podcast anyhow.
To tie it all together - Kat spent her spring break reading Blood Meridian on a beach in Mexico!
"Kmele get back slaps for wearing Cormac like a 'I'm smart!' badge"
Can you please try harder not to be a dick? Thanks in advance.
Protest more, dude.
As the internet goes, it was a pretty mild rebuke or calling out or whatever. And very much in line with the tone of this podcast which I enjoy and subscribe to. And he didn’t resort to name calling. At least in spirit, applaud and celebrate the observations you don’t necessarily like, unless they’re vile or defamatory. And unless, of course, the poster is a non-subscriber.
Generally, shit talking is best among friends and when it's funny. Also, your confidence in how Cormac would respond to a genuine admirer of his is misplaced.
Kmele continues to prove that he does not have a jewdar.
I’m only 10 minutes into the episode and it’s already exceeding my expectations for being off the rails. I saw the comments and wow, it’s much worse (and I mean better) than I could have hoped for.
I haven't finished Megyn Kelly yet! But OK, this takes precedence.
It was off the rails — more than usual
I like off the rails! This episode is a hot mess already - also LOVE.
I went to school with a Rosenfeld so that’s always how I read her name, too.
Boofing returns!
I had to Google it 🫠
I’d just finished when this was posted. Perfect timing.
I like to think all my fav podcast folks live in the same building and make the bulk of their income from having each other as guests. I would like to see the following:
Matt on Feminine Chaos, Moyn on Bridget Phetasy, and Kmele gets to take his dulcimer tones over to Smoke'em cause those gals deserve a breather from all the doom.
Kmele &
Michael &
Matt &
Katie &
Jessie &
Nancy &
Sarah &
Coleman &
Noam &
Yael &
Chaya Leah &
Josh &
Nick &
Katherine &
Peter &
Bari &
Ben &
Bridget &
Glenn &
John &
Kat &
Phoebe
If someone puts this on a t-shirt, I expect residuals.
Perfection!
Oh, I forgot Mike!
EDIT:
Kmele &
Michael &
Matt &
Katie &
Jessie &
Nancy &
Sarah &
Mike &
Coleman &
Noam &
Yael &
Chaya Leah &
Ben &
Bridget &
Glenn &
John &
Kat &
Phoebe
I'd say you forgot Meghan and the other Sarah and the other Meghan(hey, got to have at least one TERF).
Funny, I thought of Meghan & Sarah, but they already have a special place in hell.
I confess, I only listen to and now watch Megyn’s show when the lads are on it.
Well since Meghan has actually been on Nancy and Sarah's she's incestuously adjacent whether she likes it or not and we'll be going down with the rest of us.
I actually meant Meghan Murphy(The Same Drugs). Yes, she's probably in her own zone with a lot of her own issues, but she's becoming sort of the Blocked and Reported of Canada with her free speech commentary. Also the boys need to get her on just because a drunk Michael would SOOOOOOOOO hit on her.
My conservative version:
John &
Abe &
Christine &
Matt &
Seth &
Eli &
Dan &
Jonah &
David &
Sarah &
Mary Katherine &
Vic
Chris &
Eliana
& Andrew!
The Waltons go to J-School. :D
EDIT: also the only name I don't know on that list is Yael, whossat?
https://substack.com/@askajew
Note: I initially included Anna & Dasha of Red Scare, another of my favorites, but those ladies are doing their own thing. Popular recurring characters.
I imagine Noam, Glenn & John would fill the wise neighbor roles.
Nice! Imma check that. Yeah what is WITH the Red Scare ladies? It seems like no one really acknowledges they exist, or they act like no one else does. It is such an outlier to me, Anna is one of the funniest and smartest talking heads I have come across in years. Maybe its because they are always floating around topics and people that are... complicated? But I see Red Scare and Feminine Chaos as like two sides of a coin. The salt in the sweet or whatever.
That is exactly how I see RS.
The ladies don’t take the pod, or themselves, too seriously, which is part of their appeal. They’ve joked about the loose format, and both have other successful careers — in fields where one would think their “heterodox” views would hold them back. Their flat affect and seeming detachment belies their wit and intelligence. They are both very smart, very cool. I’d love to hang out with them (although I detest cigarette smoke).
Anna’s been a guest on TFC:
https://wethefifth.substack.com/p/219-w-anna-khachiyan-double-impeachments-749
She’s also been interviewed by Thaddeus Russell:
https://youtu.be/lFu5m1_EWbY?feature=shared
And Eric Weinstein:
https://youtu.be/Gs8NGrWs3mc?feature=shared
You might have seen the debate in which she participated for The Free Press:
https://www.thefp.com/p/debate
Also, the ladies did a live show a few years ago:
https://www.youtube.com/live/f9btv6Bw7bo?feature=shared
Hm. I think I’m an Anna “Stan.” A Stanna?
100% agree. That is what got me hooked. The first time I heard them with all that vocal fry and "like" or "whatevers" my brain kinda stopped processing, but as I listened I was like "Holy hell! these are wolves in sheep's clothing". You know, it occurs to me they might be too "cool kids" "dimesquare" for most. Even though they would say they are too uncool for that very crowd. I love me some lists of videos, have prolly seen a couple of them, but will be chasing that stuff this weekend for sure, so thanks for that! I am consistently making playlists for myself just due to my hoarding nature. :D Also signed up for askajew. I have a few jews I rely on for my questions, but can always use more. :D
I do think there is kind of a synergy forming with libertarians and the anti-woke left. It's like a new version of the IDW. It would be interesting to make one of those networking charts they tried to tar Joe Rogan with, but as a map of who is palling around with whom.
I agree, it is sort of like if you label everyone as SoMeThIng-adjacent you end up creating a coalition to oppose you.
Yes! Kmele on Phetasy could get just uncomfortable enough to be really funny if she goes full Phetasy. Though I hear she's married w/ a kid now, so probably not.
He was on Phetasy. Ep 112: https://open.spotify.com/episode/4IryQR8qX9aftaX4XL5U29?si=JfaRc-F-TGulaUUYRwZKjA
Pre marriage and baby or after? Her, I mean. Do you know?
Man, you’re gonna make me do math? 😆 It was published in 2021, so I think it was pre-kid* but not pre-marriage.
*I think she has said her baby is 2 now? It’s been a while since I listened to the episode, so I can’t remember what they talked about. (Maybe she mentioned marriage/pregnancy, I’m not sure.)
If you haven’t listened to her on the recent “Ask a Jew” podcast, she talked about working at Playboy and other stuff that seems pretty “Classic Bridget” to me.
Sweet! Thanks for Friday night math!
I know they don't have the show in a garage anymore, but seeing Kmele in there sitting at a card table would be worth the price of admission. :D
Yes please have Bridget Phetasy!
I'm working late tonight, listened to this hilarious episode - ending with how Moynihan would never watch the film version of London Fields.
Laughing my face off, so I scroll to some old episodes to keep it going, happened upon #357 with Lara Bazelon, and lost it, when 5 minutes in Moynihan admits to watching London Fields and how bad it was, weird timing, because I definitely wasn't looking to bust him out, but thought it was so funny that was what came up right away
My crush on him still stands, he makes me laugh til I cry, especially when he's showing off for Megan
Kat "Rosenfeld" was amazing. Loved it. I also absolutely relate personally to her story on many levels. I haven't made it to her level of success, and I'm not a journalist, but I am a YA novelist and I had many experiences with rejection based on being a WSM (White Straight Male). I started writing my novel in 2008 but it wasn't until hiring a former Random House editor that I began getting literary agents interested in reading the full book. One read it three times and wrote me glowing emails...yet disappeared. This was in 2016, just at the moment Kat refers to. One agent basically said, You know, we've had enough white male coming-of-age stories; it's time for something else. (As if each white male writer is the same and doesn't bring new style, vitality and expression to each original, fresh book.) It seemed like the beginning of The Death of Art. It's true: YA was Ground Zero for fringe Left Woke ID politics; it became less a literary genre than a tired cliche of progressive politics. That's why I finally said Screw The Gatekeepers and published the book myself. And it's doing quite well.
Lit agent rejections for my YA novel (essay): https://michaelmohr.substack.com/p/literary-agent-rejections
Michael Mohr
"Sincere American Writing"
https://michaelmohr.substack.com/
Also, WE LOVE LAME MATT.
It's almost easter and that dead, zombie man/god cured the lame, right? Or was that the pinball wizard?
I’m wayyyyyy too high to be listening to this episode rn.
Starting to feel like identity theft....
Okay, 17 minutes in and completely bonkers. I’m shocked that this is free and not paywalled for their own good. I did listen to Kat’s episode on the Live from the Cellar, and can only assume they guys share the sentiment that cancelation is over? Or was that only about the Metoo movement being over? Either way I’m loving the unhinged episode
There is a point when you can almost hear Kat wondering if this is going to get her cancelled again.
Noam is too optimistic about it being over. The unhinged far left isn’t going anywhere. It’s like wack a mole, we may win this round where people stop listening to them, but they’ll just come up somewhere else and make themselves relevant again
Moynihan, you weren’t the only one who felt bad for Kavanaugh on the stand. It was unbelievable.
She forgot to plug the excellent Feminine Chaos podcast!
https://femchaospod.substack.com/
They’ve even referenced Harold Bloom’s boneless hand! Who else but Moynihan…?
Kat, at last!
Candace Owens backstory - she didn't come out of nowhere, she came out of Gamergate, and if you want the backstory of that early culture war blowup, listen to the latest episode of Blocked & Reported. Interestingly, she started out on the social-justicey anti-Gamergate side, building a database of pro-Gamergate "harassers". This was seen as a grift by the folks she was supposed to be allied with, and long story short, she ended up flipping sides and took a rapid trajectory toward far-right politics. Ian Miles Cheong was another figure that stared out as an obscure anti-GGer, and underwent a similar trajectory to Candace Owens. Milo Yiannopulos was yet another right-wing culture warrior who gained greater notoriety on the coattails of support for Gamergate. On the other side, anti-Gamergate launched the careers of several ultra-progressives, notably Arthur Chu, Brianna Wu, and Zoe Quinn, and also raised the profile of feminist video game critic Anita Sarkeesian. However, the latter bunch all seem to have a much lower profile these days - basically, their high-profile opposition to Gamergate gave them a proverbial 15 minutes of fame that they couldn't sustain once that cultural moment had passed.
Kat Rosenfield is always worth waiting for. Once FC and Sophia left Meaningoflifetv it was the death knell for MOLTV. Still follow her and Phoebe and glad they kept their podcast going.
P.S. Honestly? I thought it was -Feld too. The Mandela effect?
I did as well and it made me realize I need an eye exam because I literally didn’t see the “I” on her Twitter handle in all the years I’ve been following her.
The Berenstain Bears phenomenon?
Now you’re just fucking with my head.
I don’t know what this is, but I would like a link to know more
Yes, I have questions:
Who is “FC”?
Who is Sophia?
What is Meaning of Life TV?
Also, -Feld? How dare you!
1) Feminine Chaos, Kat’s podcast with writer (and Daily Dish alum) Phoebe Maltz Bovy
2) I believe this was meaningoflifetv’s philosophy-centric programming
3) Along with Bloggingheads, Robert Wright’s YouTube podcasting network (originally hosted elsewhere, I believe). The Glenn Show got its start at BH as well as Feminine Chaos, Wright’s pod with Mickey Kaus, DMZ with Matt Lewis and Bill Scher, and many others. BH tended towards current events, politics, and cultural criticism, while Meaning of Life was philosophy/spirituality-oriented. Wright folded BH a couple years ago (most of the pods had gone independent by then) but he might be continuing some of philosophy programming under his Non-Zero channel.
(slaps forehead) FC...duh.
Thanks. Feminine Chaos is one of my favorite podcasts. “Sophia” confused me, and I’d never heard of MOLTV. I first started watching The Glenn Show, another favorite, on BH, which is where I discovered Kat and Phoebe. I used to watch Wright and Kaus too, but I drifted away from the channel after TGS and FC moved to Substack.
Thank you for doing my heavy lifting for me Kathleen.
The only thing I would expand on is yes Sophia was a philosophy oriented podcast under Wright's banner. While often technically philosophical, especially in the old days, I think people here would like the host Daniel Kaufman. He taught philosophy at Missouri State. He didn't countenance the far left or far right much and criticized a lot of modern philosophy for falling prey to the publish or perish syndrome and consequently felt that a lot of what was being published in philosophy was irrelevant. He turned to
more cultural and personal topics in the style of Montaigne.
He too left Wright's channel and started two subsequent channels, first the Electric Agora, and now Cathode Ray Zone. You can find both his Wright and post-Wright podcasts called Sophia on Spotify.
https://cathoderayzone.com/author/daniel-kaufman/
So, Sophia was the name of the podcast?
Who’s on first?
https://youtube.com/playlist?list=PLNKMRlDojbRLQ5l2eKOAefBE7IYQcl2lo&si=heAJXjFZDgmnn1r1