Bill Maher and the other TDS guest were so annoying! Why have Michael Moynihan on if you don’t want an actual intelligent discussion on how we got here? And no deep dive (or even a whisper) into a candidate whom I believe poses as much (maybe more?) of a threat than orange man because we can only assume she’s still as radical as she was in 2019 and she has the entire legacy media and and gov’t agencies doing her heavy lifting.
Thankful for 5th column, Reason, and the Free Press for being honest brokers and nuanced.
Anyone saying TDS after the crap Trump pulled when he lost the election in 2020 is clueless.
Moynihan, for reasons beyond me, thinks the "guardrails" will hold once again if the country is stupid enough to elect Trump again.
Kamala is a threat to democracy? Give me a break. This both sides nonsense in this election is insane. She has respect for America's democratic institutions unlike Trump.
Trump is awful and hyperbolic but he is one person, and we can be sure the media will hold him to account every minute of every day. Kamala is poster child for a side that controls media, gov't agencies, and entertainment that:
-Has as primary system to give the feel of people having a vote but then overides it with either superdelegates or last minute switcheroos
-literally and figuratively props up a guy as president for 2+ years who doesn't do press conferences, can barely speak and has to be led on stage. We have no idea who is controlling this puppet and no one on the left cares. Why have a president if some mysterious Wizard is behind the curtain anyway?
-so many covid things that are merely brushed aside- forced shots, not able to talk about lab leaks, masking 2 year olds, just complete lies about so much that our trusted institutions failed us on and no accountability.
-Trans insanity with minors (stripping parents of rights, mastectomies for healthy girls, hormones with lifelong consequences, NOT following the science or even allowing for discussion) and laws that force women's spaces to have biological males
-elimination of our borders until it is close to the election and then suddenly pretend to care.
-the post George Floyd insanity with defund the police (I live in a city where you can tell me crime numbers are down and I say someone has clearly changed the method of reporting because crime is out of control)
-All the censoring of on Social media and Youtube (twitter files, etc)
- The show trials of Trump- except for maybe Georgia, this is going after a political enemy. Its possible he would not have run if his not for his legal peril. Then we'd be hearing that DeSanctis is also hitler.
-Ideas to expand the supreme court because you don't like a ruling
-Student loan forgiveness in spite of court rulings
-Russian collusion hoax that took how many years to decide? Thinking back, a lot of the left power brokers did not treat Trump like a legitimate president the first time around.
These are just top of mind for me about how public trust in government, institutions, and media is lost. Trump arose from a country where about half the people realize the guardrails were compromised or tilted against them and no one on the right had the guts too try to get them back on track. (and I am no Trump fan)
Trump isn't going to be one person. He's going to be surrounded by clowns like Bannon and Miller and Stone who will do whatever he wants. He's going to decimate the civil service ranks and install a bunch of yes men. He'll find yes men in the military to appoint. SCOTUS has already signaled they will turn a blind eye when they ruled that the president was pretty much untouchable. The media calling him out isn't going to stop shit. If we escape with democracy intact it will be a miracle.
All the rest are just grievances for policies you don't like. Some are things you solve at the local level (like what's being taught in schools). Some are just outright fantasies. She will readily sign a border bill.No one's going to defend the police. Social Media companies censored things on their own as they have a right to do.
The only trial that was a show trial was the New York trial. In the documents case, all the moron had to do was turnover the files. But he didn't, and they had to raid him to get all of them back for crying out loud. If you're implying the trial for January 6 attempt isn't legit you're insane. He absolutely stoked the crowd up to try to interfere with the peaceful transfer of power.
JFC, I’m voting straight R ticket because of this comment. Your leftist hysteria will to continue to have the opposite effect desired. People like you are the problem; you’re the reason there was ever a Trump presidency in the first place.
Leftist Hysteria. LOL Yeah, me, a shit load of military leaders and most of his staff are engaging in liberal hysteria. I always wondered how people allowed guys like Putin, Orban, and Chavez take over. Apparently people ignore every warning sign and stick their heads in the sand because "it can't happen here, our constitution is magic.
Would you like me to send you scary Kamala articles too? Have fun being on “the right side of history.” Go take some Xanax, your neuroticism is showing.
If the Democrat party and the legacy media really believed they were keeping the democracy intact they would NEVER have let Biden skate until the June debate as those poll numbers were looking so bad.
1. SCOTUS was also protecting democrat presidents who have to make decisions that could haunt them after the fact. They have ruled against him and the republicans a lot- even this week.
2. The show trial in NY took up much time and money and if you are of the right you see how the left uses this conviction against him in the election , and you see yourself in how vulnerable you are in instances where people are charged with crimes and their houses raided for praying outside abortion clinics, the justice dept. labels parents at school board meetings terrorists, and Daniel Penny is charged with murder for trying to .keep innocent people safe.
3. Much of it is policy on both sides you either agree with or don't. He has a track record a lot of people are ok with and he did not in fact rule like Hitler. Her track record of going after drug users and parents of truant kids is disturbing as his her lack of specifics (again b/c her only record is very far left and the only thing she cares about is abortion).
4. January 6th and the election aftermath was horrible. It was disqualifying for me until the Dems ran Biden again and went after Trump on multiple fronts. I hate that he is the republican choice.
Obviously we disagree. So does half the country. I just wish Bill Maher had been more open to discussion because he had a really good guest for that in MM. Have a good day!
I was looking forward to some good MM deep dives but Time Miller just destroyed the flow. It felt like Miller was doing a comedy routine to get quick laughs and only made superficial comments.
I was thinking the same thing! I had honestly never heard of him, but it felt like he was trying out lines he had been working on. MM is really funny but more in an intelletual way and these two comedians were just talking like late night hacks that are no longer clever. It was sophomoric in that they were not open to nuance or discussion.
For all the ball breaking you guys got I am so grateful that you’re there NOT having a nervous breakdown, not clear why anyone would be served that, particularly the most distressed over the election, regardless of which direction their ire is coming from.
This is the place because you remind the audience that Wednesday will follow Tuesday, rather than destruction. The most unsettling times are when you guys are apprehensive, then I think it’s time to really worry. TBH I’m not convinced people lobbying for more hysterics would be pleased if they got their wish.
Thank you for the updates, have a great weekend, and C U Next Tuesday!
I was born into this world lol. Same hospital, different wing. Anyone who can forgive me being my own brand of crazy is my friend, those who can’t are acquaintances.
My enemies are the dishonest, the diabolical and a great many of the French.
Matt, please ask Jamie Raskin about serving on the Jan 6th committee after voting not to certify the 2016 election, assuming of course something as important as "our democracy" comes up.
I have had an unrepentant fanboy crush on Moynihan for years, but I seem to be in the minority on his Real Time appearance. I think Tim Miller ate his lunch last night. I’ve slowly started to feel like Michael, like many pundits, only truly shines in an echo chamber. His nonstop apologia tour on behalf of Trump (while always mentioning he won’t vote for him) is just getting tired. While I realize that the voices raising the alarm against Trump are more than ample, The Fifth Column is almost exclusively devoted to bashing Harris at this point.
Where I once found clear spoken thinkers, I’m utterly baffled at what the current message is. I suspect there isn’t one and the brand has become solely devoted to contrarianism without articulating superior alternatives. I suppose there is a place for that, but men old enough to know better doing a Holden Caufield impression isn’t the self-satisfied praxis Moynihan acts like it is.
I think MM has a tough barbell to lift. On one end is FP with a particular agenda and the TFC pod which is about reason and facts and logical conclusions and drinking. See how there can be a tough center to hold there? Shouldn't last long in this space. Media will continue to fracture into smaller channels, FP will sell out like HuffPo, there will always be a market for authentic appearing eloquent folks so MM will have another benefactor before long. How long did his Vice run last? This run will be half that. Hopefully, the next run he'll only serve one master.
Curious if you listened to TFC column between 2017 and 2020 and what your opinion on their Trump commentary was? There just isn't that much more to say on Trump, that isn't just rehashing the same points over and over and over and I don't think that is a successful way to run a podcast(well at least not a good podcast).
I came across TFC around 2021. I do note that in general the pod does a great job if calling BS. I do wish there was more trying to find alignment though. We have a system that really needs fixing from the school board right up to the POTUS. Allies are needed. When something like Candace or Daryl Cooper pops up it should be noted each of them have an audience that is probably more than 50% aligned with the average TFC listener. Implying Candace and Cooper are idiots show after show makes the fissures worse. I think Matt gets that but MM is too emotional. Kemele is above the fray. That is my humble admittedly myopic view.
It’s quite easy to eat when the host is in lock-step agreement with your emotive hyperbole and gives you 67% of the available time. I saw MM’s body language slip from “let me try to make a point” to “what’s the fucking point, where’s the booze” through the segments. Nothing productive was going to come from the conversation, like most bits on the show. Seriously, if MM wasn’t on the panel, would you watch that episode? I know I fast-forwarded thru Raskin’s segment because I give not one shit what he has to say, based on what I’ve already heard him say. Once everyone else is convinced that Hitler-reincarnate (version 6..2) is on the ballot, what is the point?
And everyone shines in an echo chamber. Moynihan, to his credit, is too polite to just be another dick on cable TV, unlike Tim Miller. If that was “shining”, no thank you.
While I agree with you that there is a lot of hysterics and hyperbole on the left about a future Trump presidency, I can also simultaneously hold the position that his election takes us in a dangerous direction. I think Moynihan tried too hard to downplay that threat and it made him look unserious and smug.
I disagree on his appearance. He appeared to me as the only one interested in engaging in a serious conversation. The others were interested in seeing who could call Trump the fasciest fascist. I was waiting for someone to say, "literally worse than Hitler."
If you're looking for smug, you came for Tim Miller.
Great job by Michael controlling yourself in between the pearl clutching Trump hysteria of last night’s broadcast on HBO. My favorite was towards the end of the panel Tim Miller serving up “why take the risk we descend into Nazism and Fascism” to which Bill Maher volleyed back with “Putin threw the rich people out of windows” as if to imply Donald Trump is on the verge of throwing Jeff Bezos off the White House roof if he gets elected.
Holy shit I can’t wait for this stupid fucking election to be over. I hate both candidates and if Trump wins I’m clearing out my savings to invest in every Anti-Depressant/Panic Attack drug maker known to mankind.
That free press line up... Can't wait to hear the diversity of opinion on that panel. The constant stream of I don't like Trump, but let's spend hours riffing on how the dems are the party of out of touch elites and when drill down on it aren't they about as bad as the red team? I mean really look how terrible the dems are. And yes the right wing antics are bad, but they're also not that bad and they have point. I mean really these people have a point and we should be listening to them. Immigration is an issue. The covid response was so so awful. Don't you remember 2020? We're not conspiracy theorist, but let's at least take some of the conspiracy theories seriously. Maybe the great replacement has some truth in there. Did the hunter biden lap top censorship amount to election interference? And what about Russia gate. I am not saying, but you know I am saying. Really why would anyone even vote in this election with how bad the options are, but if you vote for trump we understand you.
It is just as reactionary as all the other partisan pundits, but with a thin veneer reasonableness. Fill the panel with aggrieved former dems living and working in progressive enclaves who all seemed to view the one party as filled with their former colleagues who they mostly hate now and the other party as representing the rest of the country whom they think must be just as aggrieved by the dems as all of them. You don't need to be an out of touch elite to see that right wing populist movement in this country is actually really bad. You also don't need to be working class to understand the sentiments that right wing is tapping into. It doesn't make their politics any less ugly or harmful. It also important to point out that it is distinctly different from the democratic party and to make it out as if the differences between the parties negligible is either completely dishonest or ignorant. I think as time moves on people will come to see the free press as representative of the right wing populist movement in this country that is eventually going to burn out. I feel like we are heading that way. We just need to avoid making the mistake of electing Trump to office again before that happens.
No, we don’t need to. YOU need to avoid that “mistake” if you decide it’s imperative. Your comment will age like fine milk; the last four years have been fucking disastrous.
Not quite sure what the mistake is that your implying I will make by not voting for trump.
Also not sure how you’re qualifying the last 4 years as a disastrous, but there is big difference between the disaster of I don’t like these policies or they didn’t get as much done what I wanted them too (fairly normal) and oh shit this guy just threw the last election and refusing to leave office and his goons are standing in support behind him and now he using the military against citizen protestors. I don’t think this country has seen a disastrous presidency yet. Although January 6th was pretty fucking bad.
I am not saying this will inevitably happen if trumps gets into office, but I can almost guarantee he will try. He doesn’t need to be as bad as Hitler, or technically a fascist, to be fucking horrendous for this country. There is plenty of reason to think a 2nd term will be worst than his 1st, which was bad but ultimately his worst impulses were put in check by professional public servants. He has learned since last term and he is looking to get as many loyalists in positions of power as he can to have more unrestrained power.
Not to mention his populist economic impulses will likely tank the economy if he is able to have his way.
If your willing to stand behind this guy because you hate the dems so much, or you’re hoping he might do something you like and expect that the institutions and people in power will reign him in when it matters, or you just don’t care if he gets unfettered executive power because you agree with the actions he would take, than your willing take this country towards something that could actually be disastrous.
The Maher episode was tough to watch because two of the three people were not interested in a conversation, they were interested in spewing extreme partisan hysteria. I thought MM did great despite being outnumbered by the harpies. Vote for who you want, but the disingenuous conversations steeped in hyperbole are yawn inducing.
I used to subscribe to The Bulwark but it slowly shifted from trying to be objective and reasonable to full on MSNBC-like torch carrying for the Dems. Tim Miller became insufferable the more successful The Bulwark became and I eventually canceled subscription.
I tried to get through the Maher episode and couldn't make it to the end (no fault of MM). The fever pitch of rhetoric from Maher+Miller as we approach the election was unbearable. I suppose it's natural, as everyone is amped up awaiting Tuesday, and scaring your side into voting is the name of the game (equally so from right-leaning sources). I wonder if it's best I go hide in the mountains for the next week.
I’ve been a long time listener and subscriber, and that is solely based on how much I respect the triumvirate of the Fifth Column. But I would be lying if I didn’t express my disappointment with recent episodes, recent Bill Maher episodes, recent Free Press content, or Moynihan’s ankle grabbing appearance tonight on Real Time.
Everyone talks about the election in terms of left and right, liberal and conservative, republican and democrat, as if those are the only two choices between two equally shitty poles. Here’s a cheat sheet to winning elections: socially liberal and fiscally conservative - that’s 70% of the country. That’s what people want and no political party provides. Why social and fiscal conservatism lives in one party while social/fiscal liberalism lives in the other makes no sense. We’ve let the least equipped and least talented cast-offs take control of our lives because we surrendered giving a shit.
This shit isn’t hard, it’s just bad messaging and atrocious education. And it doesn’t help that the “independent” voices propagate the idea that there’s only one choice between two shitty options. We had so many choices before it was Trump - Harris. It’s a lazy, ignorant, and all together uninteresting confluence of bad decisions that have led us to such a terrible choice. Anyone with any self-respect about themselves or their community will ponder this
I mean - I’m going to push back pretty hard. I think this is true 10-15 years ago. But the issue now is I think a lot of the country is the complete inverse. People seem to now be socially more conservative and fiscally liberal.
The issue is the left has pushed hyper-progressive politics for the last 8-9 years. DEI, gender ideology, less parental rights, and a general sense of restricting and limiting speech (whether or not it’s happening, people feel they can’t say what they want to anymore). You’re seeing groups all across America protest this stuff at school boards, lukewarm attitudes to abortion, and certainly a general fear of being censored.
Fiscally I think COVID broke a lot of people’s brains. Stimulus checks, benefits, other financial windfalls that made people really like handouts and not give any care to the government waste and spending.
I think honestly there’s been a bizarre shift in this direction of social conservatism as a backlash to “woke” ideology (which I’m not even entirely against), and fiscal liberalism stemming from COVID spending.
Sounds like Libertarian to me! There is a candidate, but he is not on all of the state ballots. And of course, he doesn't stand a chance. Just saying that there are people out there.
The only way I’ll make it through election night is if I eat a tab of that acid that Morrison (and about half the audience) took before the walk-off music performance.
Bill Maher and the other TDS guest were so annoying! Why have Michael Moynihan on if you don’t want an actual intelligent discussion on how we got here? And no deep dive (or even a whisper) into a candidate whom I believe poses as much (maybe more?) of a threat than orange man because we can only assume she’s still as radical as she was in 2019 and she has the entire legacy media and and gov’t agencies doing her heavy lifting.
Thankful for 5th column, Reason, and the Free Press for being honest brokers and nuanced.
Anyone saying TDS after the crap Trump pulled when he lost the election in 2020 is clueless.
Moynihan, for reasons beyond me, thinks the "guardrails" will hold once again if the country is stupid enough to elect Trump again.
Kamala is a threat to democracy? Give me a break. This both sides nonsense in this election is insane. She has respect for America's democratic institutions unlike Trump.
Trump is awful and hyperbolic but he is one person, and we can be sure the media will hold him to account every minute of every day. Kamala is poster child for a side that controls media, gov't agencies, and entertainment that:
-Has as primary system to give the feel of people having a vote but then overides it with either superdelegates or last minute switcheroos
-literally and figuratively props up a guy as president for 2+ years who doesn't do press conferences, can barely speak and has to be led on stage. We have no idea who is controlling this puppet and no one on the left cares. Why have a president if some mysterious Wizard is behind the curtain anyway?
-so many covid things that are merely brushed aside- forced shots, not able to talk about lab leaks, masking 2 year olds, just complete lies about so much that our trusted institutions failed us on and no accountability.
-Trans insanity with minors (stripping parents of rights, mastectomies for healthy girls, hormones with lifelong consequences, NOT following the science or even allowing for discussion) and laws that force women's spaces to have biological males
-elimination of our borders until it is close to the election and then suddenly pretend to care.
-the post George Floyd insanity with defund the police (I live in a city where you can tell me crime numbers are down and I say someone has clearly changed the method of reporting because crime is out of control)
-All the censoring of on Social media and Youtube (twitter files, etc)
- The show trials of Trump- except for maybe Georgia, this is going after a political enemy. Its possible he would not have run if his not for his legal peril. Then we'd be hearing that DeSanctis is also hitler.
-Ideas to expand the supreme court because you don't like a ruling
-Student loan forgiveness in spite of court rulings
-Russian collusion hoax that took how many years to decide? Thinking back, a lot of the left power brokers did not treat Trump like a legitimate president the first time around.
These are just top of mind for me about how public trust in government, institutions, and media is lost. Trump arose from a country where about half the people realize the guardrails were compromised or tilted against them and no one on the right had the guts too try to get them back on track. (and I am no Trump fan)
Trump isn't going to be one person. He's going to be surrounded by clowns like Bannon and Miller and Stone who will do whatever he wants. He's going to decimate the civil service ranks and install a bunch of yes men. He'll find yes men in the military to appoint. SCOTUS has already signaled they will turn a blind eye when they ruled that the president was pretty much untouchable. The media calling him out isn't going to stop shit. If we escape with democracy intact it will be a miracle.
All the rest are just grievances for policies you don't like. Some are things you solve at the local level (like what's being taught in schools). Some are just outright fantasies. She will readily sign a border bill.No one's going to defend the police. Social Media companies censored things on their own as they have a right to do.
The only trial that was a show trial was the New York trial. In the documents case, all the moron had to do was turnover the files. But he didn't, and they had to raid him to get all of them back for crying out loud. If you're implying the trial for January 6 attempt isn't legit you're insane. He absolutely stoked the crowd up to try to interfere with the peaceful transfer of power.
“If we escape with democracy intact”
JFC, I’m voting straight R ticket because of this comment. Your leftist hysteria will to continue to have the opposite effect desired. People like you are the problem; you’re the reason there was ever a Trump presidency in the first place.
Leftist Hysteria. LOL Yeah, me, a shit load of military leaders and most of his staff are engaging in liberal hysteria. I always wondered how people allowed guys like Putin, Orban, and Chavez take over. Apparently people ignore every warning sign and stick their heads in the sand because "it can't happen here, our constitution is magic.
https://www.usnews.com/news/national-news/articles/2024-10-23/the-high-profile-military-leaders-who-have-come-out-against-donald-trump
Would you like me to send you scary Kamala articles too? Have fun being on “the right side of history.” Go take some Xanax, your neuroticism is showing.
If the Democrat party and the legacy media really believed they were keeping the democracy intact they would NEVER have let Biden skate until the June debate as those poll numbers were looking so bad.
1. SCOTUS was also protecting democrat presidents who have to make decisions that could haunt them after the fact. They have ruled against him and the republicans a lot- even this week.
2. The show trial in NY took up much time and money and if you are of the right you see how the left uses this conviction against him in the election , and you see yourself in how vulnerable you are in instances where people are charged with crimes and their houses raided for praying outside abortion clinics, the justice dept. labels parents at school board meetings terrorists, and Daniel Penny is charged with murder for trying to .keep innocent people safe.
3. Much of it is policy on both sides you either agree with or don't. He has a track record a lot of people are ok with and he did not in fact rule like Hitler. Her track record of going after drug users and parents of truant kids is disturbing as his her lack of specifics (again b/c her only record is very far left and the only thing she cares about is abortion).
4. January 6th and the election aftermath was horrible. It was disqualifying for me until the Dems ran Biden again and went after Trump on multiple fronts. I hate that he is the republican choice.
Obviously we disagree. So does half the country. I just wish Bill Maher had been more open to discussion because he had a really good guest for that in MM. Have a good day!
I was looking forward to some good MM deep dives but Time Miller just destroyed the flow. It felt like Miller was doing a comedy routine to get quick laughs and only made superficial comments.
I was thinking the same thing! I had honestly never heard of him, but it felt like he was trying out lines he had been working on. MM is really funny but more in an intelletual way and these two comedians were just talking like late night hacks that are no longer clever. It was sophomoric in that they were not open to nuance or discussion.
For all the ball breaking you guys got I am so grateful that you’re there NOT having a nervous breakdown, not clear why anyone would be served that, particularly the most distressed over the election, regardless of which direction their ire is coming from.
This is the place because you remind the audience that Wednesday will follow Tuesday, rather than destruction. The most unsettling times are when you guys are apprehensive, then I think it’s time to really worry. TBH I’m not convinced people lobbying for more hysterics would be pleased if they got their wish.
Thank you for the updates, have a great weekend, and C U Next Tuesday!
It’s kinda nice to see everyone as batshit as me for a change. Welcome to my world you neurotic psychos lol
I was born into this world lol. Same hospital, different wing. Anyone who can forgive me being my own brand of crazy is my friend, those who can’t are acquaintances.
My enemies are the dishonest, the diabolical and a great many of the French.
Matt, please ask Jamie Raskin about serving on the Jan 6th committee after voting not to certify the 2016 election, assuming of course something as important as "our democracy" comes up.
Mission of the week: Convince my Harris-loving wife that we should watch the Free Press on election night because it will be the only unbiased choice.
I have had an unrepentant fanboy crush on Moynihan for years, but I seem to be in the minority on his Real Time appearance. I think Tim Miller ate his lunch last night. I’ve slowly started to feel like Michael, like many pundits, only truly shines in an echo chamber. His nonstop apologia tour on behalf of Trump (while always mentioning he won’t vote for him) is just getting tired. While I realize that the voices raising the alarm against Trump are more than ample, The Fifth Column is almost exclusively devoted to bashing Harris at this point.
Where I once found clear spoken thinkers, I’m utterly baffled at what the current message is. I suspect there isn’t one and the brand has become solely devoted to contrarianism without articulating superior alternatives. I suppose there is a place for that, but men old enough to know better doing a Holden Caufield impression isn’t the self-satisfied praxis Moynihan acts like it is.
I think MM has a tough barbell to lift. On one end is FP with a particular agenda and the TFC pod which is about reason and facts and logical conclusions and drinking. See how there can be a tough center to hold there? Shouldn't last long in this space. Media will continue to fracture into smaller channels, FP will sell out like HuffPo, there will always be a market for authentic appearing eloquent folks so MM will have another benefactor before long. How long did his Vice run last? This run will be half that. Hopefully, the next run he'll only serve one master.
Curious if you listened to TFC column between 2017 and 2020 and what your opinion on their Trump commentary was? There just isn't that much more to say on Trump, that isn't just rehashing the same points over and over and over and I don't think that is a successful way to run a podcast(well at least not a good podcast).
I came across TFC around 2021. I do note that in general the pod does a great job if calling BS. I do wish there was more trying to find alignment though. We have a system that really needs fixing from the school board right up to the POTUS. Allies are needed. When something like Candace or Daryl Cooper pops up it should be noted each of them have an audience that is probably more than 50% aligned with the average TFC listener. Implying Candace and Cooper are idiots show after show makes the fissures worse. I think Matt gets that but MM is too emotional. Kemele is above the fray. That is my humble admittedly myopic view.
It’s quite easy to eat when the host is in lock-step agreement with your emotive hyperbole and gives you 67% of the available time. I saw MM’s body language slip from “let me try to make a point” to “what’s the fucking point, where’s the booze” through the segments. Nothing productive was going to come from the conversation, like most bits on the show. Seriously, if MM wasn’t on the panel, would you watch that episode? I know I fast-forwarded thru Raskin’s segment because I give not one shit what he has to say, based on what I’ve already heard him say. Once everyone else is convinced that Hitler-reincarnate (version 6..2) is on the ballot, what is the point?
And everyone shines in an echo chamber. Moynihan, to his credit, is too polite to just be another dick on cable TV, unlike Tim Miller. If that was “shining”, no thank you.
While I agree with you that there is a lot of hysterics and hyperbole on the left about a future Trump presidency, I can also simultaneously hold the position that his election takes us in a dangerous direction. I think Moynihan tried too hard to downplay that threat and it made him look unserious and smug.
I disagree on his appearance. He appeared to me as the only one interested in engaging in a serious conversation. The others were interested in seeing who could call Trump the fasciest fascist. I was waiting for someone to say, "literally worse than Hitler."
If you're looking for smug, you came for Tim Miller.
Great job by Michael controlling yourself in between the pearl clutching Trump hysteria of last night’s broadcast on HBO. My favorite was towards the end of the panel Tim Miller serving up “why take the risk we descend into Nazism and Fascism” to which Bill Maher volleyed back with “Putin threw the rich people out of windows” as if to imply Donald Trump is on the verge of throwing Jeff Bezos off the White House roof if he gets elected.
Holy shit I can’t wait for this stupid fucking election to be over. I hate both candidates and if Trump wins I’m clearing out my savings to invest in every Anti-Depressant/Panic Attack drug maker known to mankind.
That free press line up... Can't wait to hear the diversity of opinion on that panel. The constant stream of I don't like Trump, but let's spend hours riffing on how the dems are the party of out of touch elites and when drill down on it aren't they about as bad as the red team? I mean really look how terrible the dems are. And yes the right wing antics are bad, but they're also not that bad and they have point. I mean really these people have a point and we should be listening to them. Immigration is an issue. The covid response was so so awful. Don't you remember 2020? We're not conspiracy theorist, but let's at least take some of the conspiracy theories seriously. Maybe the great replacement has some truth in there. Did the hunter biden lap top censorship amount to election interference? And what about Russia gate. I am not saying, but you know I am saying. Really why would anyone even vote in this election with how bad the options are, but if you vote for trump we understand you.
It is just as reactionary as all the other partisan pundits, but with a thin veneer reasonableness. Fill the panel with aggrieved former dems living and working in progressive enclaves who all seemed to view the one party as filled with their former colleagues who they mostly hate now and the other party as representing the rest of the country whom they think must be just as aggrieved by the dems as all of them. You don't need to be an out of touch elite to see that right wing populist movement in this country is actually really bad. You also don't need to be working class to understand the sentiments that right wing is tapping into. It doesn't make their politics any less ugly or harmful. It also important to point out that it is distinctly different from the democratic party and to make it out as if the differences between the parties negligible is either completely dishonest or ignorant. I think as time moves on people will come to see the free press as representative of the right wing populist movement in this country that is eventually going to burn out. I feel like we are heading that way. We just need to avoid making the mistake of electing Trump to office again before that happens.
No, we don’t need to. YOU need to avoid that “mistake” if you decide it’s imperative. Your comment will age like fine milk; the last four years have been fucking disastrous.
Not quite sure what the mistake is that your implying I will make by not voting for trump.
Also not sure how you’re qualifying the last 4 years as a disastrous, but there is big difference between the disaster of I don’t like these policies or they didn’t get as much done what I wanted them too (fairly normal) and oh shit this guy just threw the last election and refusing to leave office and his goons are standing in support behind him and now he using the military against citizen protestors. I don’t think this country has seen a disastrous presidency yet. Although January 6th was pretty fucking bad.
I am not saying this will inevitably happen if trumps gets into office, but I can almost guarantee he will try. He doesn’t need to be as bad as Hitler, or technically a fascist, to be fucking horrendous for this country. There is plenty of reason to think a 2nd term will be worst than his 1st, which was bad but ultimately his worst impulses were put in check by professional public servants. He has learned since last term and he is looking to get as many loyalists in positions of power as he can to have more unrestrained power.
Not to mention his populist economic impulses will likely tank the economy if he is able to have his way.
If your willing to stand behind this guy because you hate the dems so much, or you’re hoping he might do something you like and expect that the institutions and people in power will reign him in when it matters, or you just don’t care if he gets unfettered executive power because you agree with the actions he would take, than your willing take this country towards something that could actually be disastrous.
Careful, You'll make him straight "R". Oh wait, I caused that.
The Maher episode was tough to watch because two of the three people were not interested in a conversation, they were interested in spewing extreme partisan hysteria. I thought MM did great despite being outnumbered by the harpies. Vote for who you want, but the disingenuous conversations steeped in hyperbole are yawn inducing.
Tim Miller appeared to be a completely humorless individual on Maher.
Don't tell him that, though. He clearly thinks he's the soul of wit.
I used to subscribe to The Bulwark but it slowly shifted from trying to be objective and reasonable to full on MSNBC-like torch carrying for the Dems. Tim Miller became insufferable the more successful The Bulwark became and I eventually canceled subscription.
If Trump wins, Miller should bottle his tears. He could make a mint.
I just realized the publication is different and I messaged you guys lol.
Moynihan was great on Maher. But it’s disheartening to see all the pushback to the point on fascism.
It’s such an eye roll moment when people unironically go into “fascism” diatribes
Jesus, the pearl clutching by the other guy...
MM was great (as always).
I tried to get through the Maher episode and couldn't make it to the end (no fault of MM). The fever pitch of rhetoric from Maher+Miller as we approach the election was unbearable. I suppose it's natural, as everyone is amped up awaiting Tuesday, and scaring your side into voting is the name of the game (equally so from right-leaning sources). I wonder if it's best I go hide in the mountains for the next week.
I’ve been a long time listener and subscriber, and that is solely based on how much I respect the triumvirate of the Fifth Column. But I would be lying if I didn’t express my disappointment with recent episodes, recent Bill Maher episodes, recent Free Press content, or Moynihan’s ankle grabbing appearance tonight on Real Time.
Everyone talks about the election in terms of left and right, liberal and conservative, republican and democrat, as if those are the only two choices between two equally shitty poles. Here’s a cheat sheet to winning elections: socially liberal and fiscally conservative - that’s 70% of the country. That’s what people want and no political party provides. Why social and fiscal conservatism lives in one party while social/fiscal liberalism lives in the other makes no sense. We’ve let the least equipped and least talented cast-offs take control of our lives because we surrendered giving a shit.
This shit isn’t hard, it’s just bad messaging and atrocious education. And it doesn’t help that the “independent” voices propagate the idea that there’s only one choice between two shitty options. We had so many choices before it was Trump - Harris. It’s a lazy, ignorant, and all together uninteresting confluence of bad decisions that have led us to such a terrible choice. Anyone with any self-respect about themselves or their community will ponder this
I mean - I’m going to push back pretty hard. I think this is true 10-15 years ago. But the issue now is I think a lot of the country is the complete inverse. People seem to now be socially more conservative and fiscally liberal.
The issue is the left has pushed hyper-progressive politics for the last 8-9 years. DEI, gender ideology, less parental rights, and a general sense of restricting and limiting speech (whether or not it’s happening, people feel they can’t say what they want to anymore). You’re seeing groups all across America protest this stuff at school boards, lukewarm attitudes to abortion, and certainly a general fear of being censored.
Fiscally I think COVID broke a lot of people’s brains. Stimulus checks, benefits, other financial windfalls that made people really like handouts and not give any care to the government waste and spending.
I think honestly there’s been a bizarre shift in this direction of social conservatism as a backlash to “woke” ideology (which I’m not even entirely against), and fiscal liberalism stemming from COVID spending.
Sounds like Libertarian to me! There is a candidate, but he is not on all of the state ballots. And of course, he doesn't stand a chance. Just saying that there are people out there.
I'm so mad that Matt beat me to the cunt joke. 😡
wait what
Disclaimer: not actually mad! I should have been faster on the draw.
I … don’t know to what you refer.
Oh! Sorry! The “see you next Tuesday” bit in this firehose. Didn’t mean to cause confusion!
Oh, got it. Gentle stuff.
Live show Tuesday?
Yes, as mentioned. Probably one at 9 and one at midnight, about an hour each.
The free press is doing one with the Irish Menace
I assume they couldn’t get kmele to come on since he’s at a conference
Kmele will be in attendance.
Fucking Kmele
The only way I’ll make it through election night is if I eat a tab of that acid that Morrison (and about half the audience) took before the walk-off music performance.